PCM42 and PCM60

[JeffS]

For those of you who have the the PCM42 and the PCM60, do you use them together? If so, do you connect them in series with the reverb effect last? I have always read recommendations that said to have reverb last, but the PCM42's user manual recommends the PCM42 be the last in the chain.

I don't have either of these units, but I have a Lexicon MX200 Dual Processor. You can define proceessor 1 or 2 as reverb or delay; processor 1 is 1st and processor 2 is 2nd in the signal path. I was interested in anyone's thoughts as to the order of the effects and how the final sound/tone is effected.

Thanks,
Jeff Stovall

[albertgen]

I tried that once, they don't sound good together. Al

[JeffS]

Hi Al,

Thanks for the reply. I agree that reverb and delay together seems too busy the sound/tone, but I've wondered if it was just my set-up. But the loss of clarity is evident whether I use effects pedals or an effects processor; I don't have the PCM42 or PCM60, so I thought that the higher quality units might make a difference.

I can never tell for sure what effects Chet and Paul used. You definitely hear echo/delay on Chet's early recordings (the Fingerstyle Guitar album, Mr Sandman, etc), but later I don't hear it. To me, I hear reverb on songs like Yes Ma'am (especially in the intro), etc. I can't tell if Chet stopped using delay (except on songs like Snowbird) or just made it more subtle. Also, I can't tell if reverb and delay are used together.

I'm always trying to improve my overall tone by closely listening to Chet's and Paul's recordings, but I have trouble really discerning the subtlties of the effects, etc. I never seem to really be able to produce what I'm looking for. I guess that is one of the intriguing things about guitar and music in general - an unending quest to improve and achieve a certain sound/tone. I believe much of it is in your hands and touch - equipment, while important, can never make up for lack of technique.

Thanks,
Jeff Stovall

[Vidar Lund]

Jeff, interesting posts. It´s too easy to tell you to listen carefully. Our ears are fabulous instruments, but the sound we hear depends on the environment, furniture, carpets, curtains and so on. I have struggled with sound for more than forty years, wait, almost fifty!, and have sometimes hit gold, and then again not. Effect boxes used together may "collide" and produce bad sound. The Chet-sound we enjoy so much was analog and today´s gear usually is digital. There´s a difference. Chet, Paul and other masters, think Richard Hudson, use effects sparingly and with great taste. What I try to say is really, take your time and listen carefully and move in small steps.. Not much of an advice I admit.

[JeffS]

Thanks Vidar,

I think effects can definitely reduce clarity and cleanness. I, like you, have been playing for a long time - about 42 years and listening to Chet for 41 years of that time. To me, one of his most beautiful albums was The Most Popuilar Guitar. There's not much thumb-style playing on it, but the tone is just amazing. To me, that album exemplifies what an electric guitar should sound like.

Like you said, some days I like my tone better than others - even with no changes in set-up, it sounds different/better on some days. I guess it's my ears. One thing that is interesting to me is, I find myself liking my Gibson CG more than my Gretsch 59 NC. I can't put a finger on it, but it just seems to sound better. I wish I had another Gretsch to compare mine to - I guess it could be something about my guitar. I feel like the Getsch should come closer to the sound I like, but the Gibson seems closer.

I played my Gretsch through a Victoria Victoriette amp (6L6's and 1-12" speaker), and I really liked it. With the reverb turned off and no additional effects it sounded the best that I've ever played. Unfortunately, I was unable to buy the amp, and haven't found another one to try. I hesitate to order one, because amps, like guitars, seem to vary in tone from one to another.

I enjoy your songs that you post from time-to-time. Keep them coming!

Thanks,
Jeff Stovall

[Vidar Lund]

You´re correct. Amplifiers (and instruments) are almost human in the way they may change from day to day, just like us. Effect boxes/pedals will usually negatively affect the pureness of the sound, while adding something else, like echo, delay, sustain, bass, treble etc. etc. Seems we´re fighting an uphill struggle and better retire to a room listening to our idols! They knew how to do it.